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Postby kocab22 » Wed Feb 13, 2013 8:37 pm

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Subject title: futuristic sky station...

Hi,

So Im except some pencil sketches in my sketchbook also working digitally, but this time I decided to try to do something else.. Impulse was again from CGHBUB drawing Jam. This time the topic is sky stations.. Here is what I have so far, even it looks amateur I like it.. But still there is ofcaurse a lot to improve.. Id love to hear some critiques, especially regarding composition and colours. Thank you ;)

I do not consider this as done, but I just cant watch it by myself any more :D
Untitled-9.jpg

 

Postby Zjacklee » Wed Feb 13, 2013 9:05 pm

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I like the concept and I really like the environment colours here. Nice!

As for critique, the floating stations could use some more care in their shape. At least if it's a metal construction. Or is it some kind of rocky floating island in which people constructed a living and a way to operate it?
I find it a bit difficult to tell that much about it's material. I would add some more small details that could indicate any of this. ( doesn't need to be everywhere, only in the lightest parts )
Furthermore, i would make the edges of the things in the background less hard.

all in all, nice work. I like the way you made what's going more into the background less saturated. indicating the distance and the atmosphere in between the objects. :)

and what's that black bit all the way in the foreground to the right? And what are those small black shards around the towers?
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Postby kocab22 » Wed Feb 13, 2013 9:49 pm

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Thank you Zjacklee for kind words..

Unfortunately I cant tell any answer for your questions :D
- The black thing on the right is not finished, have to decide what do do with it, but I wanned to add some foreground to the right. I suppose it is par of other building :)..
- material of buildings is unknown :D, thirst I thought it will be glass or somethin like that, but than I kind of liked my rough lookin shape, but that rock is not a bad idea, I might do reflections in that light areas and it will look like some rock or crystal.. That is what I have to learn as well, as I see other concepts in Jam, people are really thinking how their stations are working and so on.. I was more independent, not really thinking about physics etc..
- Small floating things.. This was in my "concept" some kind of parking for ships, or something like that. But now I really like how they are pitch black, it makes beautiful contrast with that background colour.. I will probably try to make somethin withh them ..

Btw I used Alchemy to make my first sketch of this. It is pretty fun software, really can open mind and give you more creative ideas.. You have to use your brain to find shapes in all that scribbling..

Time to go back to TV, Manchaster is playing with Real :shock:

 

Postby Total100 » Thu Feb 14, 2013 4:21 am

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is the one in the background and forground the same? becouse in the background the top piece it bigger then the lower piece. in the forground one the top one is SMALLER then the top one.
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Here is my sketchbook= viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2900 :)

 

Postby kocab22 » Thu Feb 14, 2013 10:23 am

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no they are supposed to be random size.. Didnt want to make them same, otherwise I will just copy the one from front to back...

 

Postby perkexpert » Thu Feb 14, 2013 10:33 pm

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Hi kocab,

first of all: Very nice mood with the red sky and purple/dark clouds, i like it a lot. I think you got a bit of a composition issue here and the massive size of these things doesnt show inho or is a bit awkward.
I tried my hand on it by adding flying repeating vehicles, landing pads, antennas and stuff to suggest some scale. Put a bit of foreground in and indicate the perspective lines. Im still not happy with composition
as the foreground now is a bit on the heavy side, but at least its a start... So i hope my ideas show a bit in this quick sketch. Anyhow, id love to see a finished piece!
skystationy.jpg
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Postby Total100 » Thu Feb 14, 2013 11:04 pm

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perkexpert wrote:Hi kocab,

first of all: Very nice mood with the red sky and purple/dark clouds, i like it a lot. I think you got a bit of a composition issue here and the massive size of these things doesnt show inho or is a bit awkward.
I tried my hand on it by adding flying repeating vehicles, landing pads, antennas and stuff to suggest some scale. Put a bit of foreground in and indicate the perspective lines. Im still not happy with composition
as the foreground now is a bit on the heavy side, but at least its a start... So i hope my ideas show a bit in this quick sketch. Anyhow, id love to see a finished piece!


:o
how "quick" was this "quick" sketch? lol this is really nice. i noticed a lot of your cretiques are very nicely drawn. props!
"Art is my cooking channel, i watch it, drool over it, and hope to one day make it."
I'm Alex, I'm 12,
Here is my sketchbook= viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2900 :)

 

Postby Zjacklee » Thu Feb 14, 2013 11:11 pm

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perkexpert wrote:Hi kocab,

first of all: Very nice mood with the red sky and purple/dark clouds, i like it a lot. I think you got a bit of a composition issue here and the massive size of these things doesnt show inho or is a bit awkward.
I tried my hand on it by adding flying repeating vehicles, landing pads, antennas and stuff to suggest some scale. Put a bit of foreground in and indicate the perspective lines. Im still not happy with composition
as the foreground now is a bit on the heavy side, but at least its a start... So i hope my ideas show a bit in this quick sketch. Anyhow, id love to see a finished piece!


Nice buddy! you adressed everything I was talking about in my earlier post and even a bit more.
Look closely. Can you really See?!

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Postby alnoth » Fri Feb 15, 2013 8:23 am

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hey perk, nice paint over - i still think too much attention is drawn to the sun - could you maybe make the cyan lights on the left structure real shiny? i think if they POP out really strongly, they would drag some attention away from the sun towards the stuff you actually design.

 

Postby kocab22 » Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:01 am

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Hey Perk,

Thanks for your awesome critique.. I always adore your effort to show people your suggestions in paintings or "re-paintings". I like your idea, especially how you changed the architecture and show the scale by planes.. I might try something similar and I also might finish the foreground..
I was more practising my gestures/figures last few days, so maybe on weekend I can do something on this one again..
Anyway thank you a lot. Btw I follow your sketchbook and it is really nice, I love your caricatures a lot.. I might send you picture of me and maybe one day you can make one of me ? :D I might use it as avatar here in forum than :D..

Have a good one mate..

 

Postby alnoth » Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:21 pm

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couldnt resist... :D

i wanted the focus to go toward the main "building" here - theres tons more detailing possible, but you know... im in the office... :mrgreen:
skystationy.jpg

 

Postby perkexpert » Fri Feb 15, 2013 2:06 pm

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Wheee!!! Alnoth, i didn't notice the other details when i first looked at it, really nice subtle stuff! The slight blue tint goes very nicely with the overall redish tone! And i totally agree...when i went to bed, i had this "there's so much more to do" feeling
and i actually researched pictures with this lighting to see wether the sun is really that bright white 8-) , maybe ill give it another try, it's just an awesome scene and has really potential, so thanks to kocab for posting
@total: I spent around 35min on it, so not really "quick" but after doing like 12h + valuepaintings then 30mins feels just like a quick doodle :9 And thx for the comment!
@Zjacklee: I actually read your comments after i posted my picture i had to smile a bit as you adressed the same points
@kocab: Thank you for the kind words, and i really like the familarity in this forum and the growth and learning spirit and i like to challenge myself with these paintovers too.
As it is on thing to "see" matters that could be improved on and quite another to actually execute them in a convincing manner. And for someone else it's far easier to just erase whole lot of
stuff you have grown fond off while working on it. Do you have any kind of reference image for the sky/sun you could post? Maybe this develops into some kind of community-project :) And alnoth...
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Postby alnoth » Fri Feb 15, 2013 2:16 pm

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oh, i dont know, but id love to see it go further, theres definitely room! (i thought the same thing about the brownish-orange vs the cyan - complementary colors, eh?)

as of tomorrow im gonna drive my family to slovakia and come back to some two weeks or so without them - so ill get some time to do my stuff, but... i will be busybusybusy working on my mech design...

btw, i still dont see why the sun is not round...? :?:

 

Postby perkexpert » Fri Feb 15, 2013 3:05 pm

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And another try with the sun...moved the sun almost to the center of the central perspective lines (at least were i put it :) )
@alnoth: cool, can you post your mechstuff? ill just have a look at your sketchbook!
reworked_01.jpg
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Postby alnoth » Fri Feb 15, 2013 3:08 pm

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sorry, no wips yet, i have a few sketches here and there but didnt bother to scan them. i keep pushing it off since i know i will have some quality time, rather than some odd 15 minutes here or there...

 

Postby kocab22 » Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:51 pm

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wow Im really happy how you guys like my painting and how you are trying to improve it :)) ...

Regarding the sun, I was using some reference pictures and I remember that the sun was really bright white, it can also be like yours though.

I will give it a try and do something with it now, but Im not sure if I can push it so good as you guys.. :)

 

Postby perkexpert » Fri Feb 15, 2013 10:10 pm

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Hi Kocab, feel free to use this pic, i'm sure alnoth wouldn't mind either... :)
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Postby Zjacklee » Fri Feb 15, 2013 10:37 pm

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kocab22 wrote:wow Im really happy how you guys like my painting and how you are trying to improve it :)) ...

Regarding the sun, I was using some reference pictures and I remember that the sun was really bright white, it can also be like yours though.

I will give it a try and do something with it now, but Im not sure if I can push it so good as you guys.. :)


While the bright sun might not be wrong either... We choose to make it less bright to change the focal point in your painting. It's just a conscious choice as an artist what you want to be more important on your canvas. :)
Look closely. Can you really See?!

http://zjacklee.deviantart.com/ that's my deviant. ^_^

https://www.facebook.com/Trplerainbow My fanpage.

 

Postby kocab22 » Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:47 pm

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So I played with it a little.. This is what I have so far, Im catching myself how Im sometimes working in pixels while whole canvas is like 5000pixels big ! So Im pretty slow with :/.. I changed the city a bit and add that ships to show that scale ..
My pc is pretty fucked from this painting already, I have to buy that RAM because this way its useless ..

Your right Zjack I will have to change that sun, because it takes too much attention. Even I like it this way, I prefer people to watch the city rather than sun :D.
Untitled-8.jpg
Untitled-81.jpg

 

Postby Aangkat » Sat Feb 16, 2013 7:47 am

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OMG :O YOu guys are aweosme!

 

Postby alnoth » Sat Feb 16, 2013 7:59 am

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i think you should make a conscious choice to really make the rows of windows be in different perspectives when they are in the different planes of the "building". they are still on a sort of ellipse just going around the whole thing, which makes it more difficult to understand the shape of the "building".

 

Postby perkexpert » Sat Feb 16, 2013 1:20 pm

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Hi Kocab, first of all i would work on the general composition first before going too much into detail, as no amount of detail will help your illustration when the foundation is missing. I also miss some kind of general design theme in your middle structure. I'd either go for a round structure or a pyramidal one, not both. I would also focus on one general idea: Do you want a design of the skystructure, then make it a focal point or do you want a "big grand opening shot", in the latter the overall big shapes are way more important than the little ones. You did see, when alnoth just added some planes here and there on my basic "blop" it already came to life sufficiently There are still some awkward tangents like the thing the guy is standing on reaching into the first structure, as well as the aircraft, i would
put it more to the right, to "point" towards the main structure. maybe another to piont to the other side.
Again, perspective and scale of your first structure is not correct. Look at the windows of the skyscraper in the middle section and the windows of the main structure, if its for humans, it should have the same size.

Cheers and keep it up!
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Postby kocab22 » Sat Feb 16, 2013 4:24 pm

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Well Im getting pretty tiered of this one, Im not really patient person and this is taking too long time :) .. I dont like the actual look and Im angry, because Id like to follow all that good tips from you, it is just out of my skill level.. So better to stop working on it, otherwise I might destroy something :D.. If someone will want my original PSD file to play with this , I can send it. No problem .. Thanks everybody for good comments, I really appreciate it ;)
Untitled-10.jpg

 

Postby alnoth » Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:02 pm

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i think you get tired and overwhelmed because you started adding the tiniest details too soon. you should work from the whole to the detail. when you are completely satisfied with the overall composition and shapes, move on to another level of detail. you should work in certain level of detail and not really move to the next level before the first one is more or less complete over the whole image. i think you went too fast for the smallest details.

 

Postby Ambiguity » Sat Feb 16, 2013 9:00 pm

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alnoth wrote:i think you get tired and overwhelmed because you started adding the tiniest details too soon. you should work from the whole to the detail. when you are completely satisfied with the overall composition and shapes, move on to another level of detail. you should work in certain level of detail and not really move to the next level before the first one is more or less complete over the whole image. i think you went too fast for the smallest details.

+1

Try to plan out the idea more next time, grab some references on what you can, work out the composition in thumbnail sketches, size it up and reblock in your main shapes, then work your way to the details. The better you plan, the better the foundation will be, less things need to be fixed later on as a result, and the painting will be less stressful so you'll finish it.

That's why I stopped focusing so much on making finished pieces and focused on my basic drawing skills. I realized I didn't pay enough attention to the initial sketch so I was always running into problems in the painting phase.

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