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Postby DarkLored123 » Sat Jan 27, 2018 4:01 am

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Subject title: Greyscale Painting Critique

Hello, I have been trying to get more into practicing my values and painting overall by trying greyscale painting, now I have watched a video of Istabrak's about form and light and tried out what I learned from the video. My main objective in this one was to get the values and lighting right, but it seems kind of off and not convincing enough, I want to keep the face relatively flat but still conveying form to some degree, and I noticed that I have trouble drawing the shapes for the lights so any tips would be appreciated.


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Postby Audiazif » Sat Jan 27, 2018 4:16 pm

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I think the value and lighting seem for the most to be working and following the form. I think the actual issue here is the form and the drawing. The biggest thing is you are skewing and distorting the face and head to show more than what would be showing. People have a tendency to want to draw things so they see more than they actually would, basically distorting things to be more of a front view. An example would be drawing a 3/4 view head but drawing the features like they were in a front view on a 3/4 head. In your image this is happening but in possibly three directions. You are slightly doing the "3/4 view thing" like in the example (+ not accounting for the side plane), the eyes and nose look as if they were on a head that is tilted back but not form a very low angle, and the chin indicates a much lower angle than what the eyes and nose show but doesn't show the head tilting back. I think using a reference would be helpful, especially for complicated angles of the head. Even going through the orientation of the forms would help.
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Postby Josephcow » Sat Jan 27, 2018 5:37 pm

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It's a tough angle and tough lighting to pull off. Istebrak would suggest that you try a head from the front, with light from the front and above.

 

Postby Snakebreath » Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:37 am

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I really like it! Overall I would suggest doing some lighting/value studies. The drawing is quite good, but it feels overall flat because of how close together the values are.

A good test in Photoshop is to hit Image > Auto Contrast. If the image changes drastically, thats a good indication that the values are flat. I went over it with a couple multiply layers just to show what a quick darkness pass can do.
0flD8v1.jpg

 

Postby DarkLored123 » Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:03 pm

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Snakebreath wrote:I really like it! Overall I would suggest doing some lighting/value studies. The drawing is quite good, but it feels overall flat because of how close together the values are.

A good test in Photoshop is to hit Image > Auto Contrast. If the image changes drastically, thats a good indication that the values are flat. I went over it with a couple multiply layers just to show what a quick darkness pass can do.


Ah thank you! That's exactly what I was missing. I'll definitely do some studies on lighting/value during the following weeks, thank you so much for bringing my flaw to my attention :)

@Auzadif, Yes I get where you are coming from, I fixed the nose placement, but simply can't see how the face would work otherwise, I was aiming for a slightly low angle with a slightly 3/4th view, the character that I drew is technically tilting their head to the right to create that effect, I simply can't wrap my head around how to preserve the anime look without actually applying more dimensions to the face that would otherwise wouldn't be present in this style. My intention was to distort the face and not add too much dimension to it other than significant areas such as the nose. Most cases people even remove the nose completely when doing these angles to show more of the eyes and create appeal, so if you could give me a more of a visual demonstration of what I could do without sacrificing certain elements such as the distortions of the face I am willing to work with it.

@Josephcow I haven't actually planned to do this illustration, it is just a sketch a I did and decided to refine it so most cases I just go with the flow regardless of difficulty. I think some value studies will help me with that, the perspective can always use some work but I am confident enough to do these kinds of angles since normal angles seem to be much more easier now than they were in the past, although I need to get into the habit to play with the variations since I noticed a very bad habit of always aiming for the same 3/4th angle which I am trying to currently pull out of and explore other ones.

 

Postby Audiazif » Sun Jan 28, 2018 7:20 pm

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Image

Here is a quick edit with a few tweaks that I would make. I am not an anime artist so take from it what you will. I understand it might not be exactly what you are going for but I did what I could to keep some of the flatness and without having to redraw the entire head.
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Postby DarkLored123 » Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:32 pm

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Sorry for the late reply,

Auzadif I get your point very clearly, thank you for bringing it to my attention as well as now I am actually more conscious about how I draw the planes of the face. I decided to give up on the piece since I lack a lot of knowledge about how to paint and it is simply too stressful to learn at the moment, especially applying values I just have a hard time with it and taking on a drawing that is fairly complex was a huge mistake.

 

Postby Ambiguity » Sat Feb 03, 2018 10:34 pm

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I don't fault you for wanting to give up on it, but I disagree that it was a "huge mistake" to attempt this. Doing things that are too hard for you is the only way to improve, if it was too easy it'd be a good indicator that there was not much to learn there. It's like playing video games, eventually you get to a stage that is too hard for you, and the only way to get better is to keep playing that stage, or even something harder that makes that one seem easy by comparison.

 

Postby CaptainKiryu » Fri Apr 06, 2018 4:19 am

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I figured that one of the big reasons you were having value issues was due to unclear forms and a confused light source. I am sort of in-between drawing software so I just printed off your drawing, did a draw-over and made some notes. I also took off the hair and clothes because I didn't want to give you too much to focus on at once.

To be honest, this is a difficult angle of the head/face to work with and if you want to focus on your values, it might be helpful to give yourself a more basic angle that you've worked with more to paint on. I have also found it much easier to do these sorts of studies in large quantities on paper before using digital media because you can make the drawings smaller and less labour-intensive. It could also be easier to do value studies on more realistic, 3D things in the beginning---like real faces---just so you get sort of an idea of how to deal with the shadows in the derivative, anime style.

Scanned at 7-22-2003 0-16 AM (3).jpg


Of course, my drawing is not perfect, and if you do not find it helpful you can ignore my notes. Just keep moving forward.
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Postby DarkLored123 » Fri Apr 06, 2018 4:32 am

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Thank you for the response. After I did this I pretty much gave up on trying to tackle values and focus more on drawing since I had clear issues that were pointed out to me not too long after this post. I will reference this in the future if the circumstances will deem it necessary.


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